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Pablo P. Practice Journal

  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92663 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:3hdnbm8f]Date:[/b:3hdnbm8f] 04/20/13 and 04/21/13
[b:3hdnbm8f]Pre-Meditative Context:[/b:3hdnbm8f] 15' ReWire concentration app plus 15' stretching and Qigong.
[b:3hdnbm8f]Length of Sits: [/b:3hdnbm8f]20' on Saturday and 60' on Sunday
[b:3hdnbm8f]Posture:[/b:3hdnbm8f] half-lotus
[b:3hdnbm8f]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:3hdnbm8f] ???
[b:3hdnbm8f]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:3hdnbm8f] out-loud and silent 4FN. At the end of the session APE.
[b:3hdnbm8f]General Thoughts: [/b:3hdnbm8f]
* After some post exchanges with a fellow practitioner, I return to detailed noting of thoughts
* By noting thoughts, spacing out was shortened a lot
* Much of the not-self thoughts are related to mind-states
[b:3hdnbm8f]Aversion baseline:[/b:3hdnbm8f] ~2
[b:3hdnbm8f]Noting Dynamics:[/b:3hdnbm8f] Started with tightness, twitches, stings, outer & inner noise, fine vibrations in the shoulders, thoughts. No heat, sweet taste or discomfort. Some bubbling sensations between the Crown and Brow Chakra, with a cool/warmth mix. This time there were no tightness nor discomfort in the chest and throat area. Instead, as I noted thoughts in detail, there was an ever present tension in the skull, temples and cheeks. Aversion 2 to those tensions, with little reduction when focusing on a spot. Little spacing out. Coolness in the lower back, which spread to the front and inner thighs, but didn't went up to the neck.

When noting thoughts, at first noted remembering, fantasy, analyzing. Then, analyzing and (a lot of) rehearsing. Some images-thoughts showed up. At the end, planning, analyzing and rehearsing. The not-self thoughts that weren't ill-formed words or phrases, were related to mental-states, like surprise, worry, relief/understanding, upset.
[b:3hdnbm8f]Goal for Next Session:[/b:3hdnbm8f] Keep doing the 4FN & the concentration practice.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92664 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Wording it out:
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92665 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Yesterday's report.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92666 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:1ibe75ds]Date: [/b:1ibe75ds]04/22/13 and 04/23/13
[b:1ibe75ds]Pre-Meditative Context:[/b:1ibe75ds] 10' ReWire concentration app, 10' stretching and Qigong.
[b:1ibe75ds]Length of Sits:[/b:1ibe75ds] 60' on Monday and 60' on Tuesday
[b:1ibe75ds]Posture:[/b:1ibe75ds] half-lotus
[b:1ibe75ds]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:1ibe75ds] DÑ
[b:1ibe75ds]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:1ibe75ds] out-loud and silent 4FN. At the end of the session APE.
[b:1ibe75ds]General Thoughts: [/b:1ibe75ds]
* Much of the not-self thoughts are related to mind-states such as amaze, upset, condemn, fear and specially judgmental
* Played with questioning (why?) when those mental states showed up, and in many cases it triggered the stilling of the mind. Later, EIS explained that that wasn't the actual practice he was suggesting, but nevertheless I found it interesting.
[b:1ibe75ds]Aversion baseline:[/b:1ibe75ds] I now understand that aversion should be evaluated not only on its physical response but also mental side.
[b:1ibe75ds]Noting Dynamics:[/b:1ibe75ds] Heat, tightness, twitches, stings, outer & inner noise, fine vibrations in the shoulders and the head, remembering, fantasy, analyzing, rehearsing, discomfort, spacing-out, bubbling sensations in the skull, later coolness in the Brow Chakra and lower back. Next, cooling sensation running up through the back to chest level, and then by sections the neck up to the Crown and down to the Brow Chakra. Yet, no calmness, throat tightness never passed away. Oddly, tension in the head didn't appear until late in the session.
[b:1ibe75ds]Goal for Next Session:[/b:1ibe75ds] Keep doing the 4FN & the concentration practice.
  • NickP
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12 years 9 months ago #92667 by NickP
Replied by NickP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Would you mind logging about one of the next sits including the chronology of phenomena?
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92668 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Usually, I right more or less in chronological order. I'll do it in detail today. Thanks for the interest!
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92669 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:d8sxibqb]Date:[/b:d8sxibqb] 04/24/13
[b:d8sxibqb]Pre-Meditative Context:[/b:d8sxibqb] Throat discomfort throughout the day. 5' stretching and Qigong, Noted vibrations on the back and dantien right before sitting.
[b:d8sxibqb]Length of Sits:[/b:d8sxibqb] 45'
[b:d8sxibqb]Posture:[/b:d8sxibqb] half-lotus
[b:d8sxibqb]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:d8sxibqb] ???
[b:d8sxibqb]Meditative Techniques Utilized: [/b:d8sxibqb]silent noting and writing labels down every 2-3 minutes.
[b:d8sxibqb]General Thoughts: [/b:d8sxibqb]
* During the first half of the session, noted chest tightness right after writing labels down. The tightness passed away in 10-30 seconds.
* Lots of reporting thoughts, because of the writing labels down. Couldn't get any deep because of this too.
[b:d8sxibqb]Aversion baseline:[/b:d8sxibqb] n/a

[b:d8sxibqb]Noting Dynamics / Chronological Order:[/b:d8sxibqb] Vibrations, outside noise, heat in the head, mild discomfort in the chest, disgust~nausea at the throat, remembering, vibrations, discomfort gone at chest and throat, sneezed twice, outside noise, vibrations at the torso and head, inner noise, seeing, vibrations in the dantien (lower belly), remembering, coolness at the Crown Chakra, pulsing skull, tension in the jaw, calmness, coolness in the Brow Chakra, agitation in the chest, release tension in the skull, coolness in the Brow Chakra, agitation, calmness, cool dantien, agitation and cool chest, cool arms, heat at the crossed foot, remembering, faster vibrations in the arms, melody, head tension, coolness release at the skull and temples, seeing darkness, jaw tension release, vibrations in the head, thought out of the blue "How? The patriots?", reporting, heat and tigh foot, cool neck, release tension, agitation, coolness running down from Crown to Brow Chakra, tight chest, cool head flowing down to chest, cool arms, reporting, jaw tension release, seeing dark then flickering, remembering, melody, tight leg, heat leg, seeing lights, analyzing, tension release in the head, out of the blue thought "Tell a story", agitation, arm spams, cool head, melody, disgust, heat head, heat, vibrations in the head and torso, release tension, startling outside noise, read abstract image, heat leg, heat head, cool Brow, release tension, vibrations in the chest, cool torso, analyzing, tense jaw, heat leg, cool chest, vibrations at the torso and head, tension in the Brow, heat leg, analyzing, jaw tension, release, seeing dark, aversion to lights, out of the blue thought "Ohh, what then?", heat leg, heat torso, bell alarm rings.

[b:d8sxibqb]Goal for Next Session: [/b:d8sxibqb]Keep doing the 4FN & the concentration practice.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92670 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:32gl281o]Date:[/b:32gl281o] 04/25/13
[b:32gl281o]Pre-Meditative Context: [/b:32gl281o]waking up from a nap a being able to jump into a HD colorful (amazing but mundane) scenario. It has been happening (in varying degrees) in the last few days. Still trying not to spoil it with anticipation, etc.
[b:32gl281o]Length of Sits:[/b:32gl281o] 40'
[b:32gl281o]Posture: [/b:32gl281o]half-lotus
[b:32gl281o]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:32gl281o] n/a
[b:32gl281o]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:32gl281o] silent noting and writing labels down every 2-3 minutes.
[b:32gl281o]General Thoughts: [/b:32gl281o]
* Instead of building tension because of leg pain, changed the position around the middle of the session
* Noticed I'm not noting enough the 3C's.
[b:32gl281o]Aversion baseline:[/b:32gl281o] n/a
[b:32gl281o]Noting Dynamics / Chronological Order:[/b:32gl281o] Vibrations at the torso and head, foot pain, tension at the shoulders, vibrations, cool lower back, agitation, twitches in the face, mapping, coolness at lower back and dantien, thought, heat in the head, reporting, vibrations, cool dantien, twitches in the arms, tension in the shoulders, lost in thoughts, cool dantien, tension in the shoulders, remembering, analyzing, released tension in the jaws, nausea, pulse in the throat, released tension in the jaws, vibrations, dissolved into tinnier vibrations, "don't know if you have realized", bubblinh right jaw, "it is not mine", "Néstor" (!!), mild discomfort in the chest, vibrations in the chest, "what took you?" (to get it done), rehearsing, chest discomfort, vibrations, vibrations passed away, "let it go" , leg pain, changed legs position, pulse in the head, calmness, cool chest, vibrations in the throat, hunger, coolness in the lower back, bubbling dantien, calmness, mapping (3C's), "it's magic", vibrations, bubbling skull, coolness flows down to the Brow Chakra, "are you afraid?", lost in thoughts, cool Brow Chakra, cool dantien, "you lost it dumb-ass", cool brow chakra, calmness, seeing (darkness), smell of roses, nice smell, "Now", calmness, remembering, sting in the neck. Time is up.
[b:32gl281o]Goal for Next Session:[/b:32gl281o] Keep doing the 4FN & the concentration practice.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92671 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Wording it out...
  • NickP
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12 years 9 months ago #92672 by NickP
Replied by NickP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Very interesting. And I'd love to see Néstor in the word-it-out version!

How does the energetic activity interact with thoughts?

See if you can pay attention to the process by which thoughts and other mental activity arise. How things that start out as something other than thoughts, morph into thoughts. Try to see how early in that process you can become aware of them.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92673 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Clinging & aversion to anything is what trigger thoughts. Many times they appear during the time out-side noise lasts, say 30-60 seconds, as long as a car passes by. Other times, they appear because of energy activity. There's agitation, then some kind of aversion either to a narrow or wider visual focus, later analysis, then heat in the face and limbs, finally images, phrases, melodies or a combo of them three.

Perhaps buying noise-cancelling headphones would be a good thing to do. At least it would help me get more times quicker to calm states. I'll open a separate thread about them.

[b:2g5q71dy][u:2g5q71dy]EDIT: [/u:2g5q71dy][/b:2g5q71dy]Actually, after writing the report I read that ear-plugs are far better for meditation, and way cheaper.

----

[b:2g5q71dy]Date: [/b:2g5q71dy]04/28/13
[b:2g5q71dy]Pre-Meditative Context: [/b:2g5q71dy]10' concentration app, 10' stretching & qigong
[b:2g5q71dy]Length of Sits:[/b:2g5q71dy] 45'
[b:2g5q71dy]Posture: [/b:2g5q71dy]half-lotus
[b:2g5q71dy]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:2g5q71dy] n/a
[b:2g5q71dy]Meditative Techniques Utilized: [/b:2g5q71dy]silent noting and writing labels down every 5-10 minutes.
[b:2g5q71dy]Noting Dynamics / Chronological Order: [/b:2g5q71dy]"food", heat, jaw release, foot pain, calmness, vibrations up the spine, spine humming/vibrating, chest discomfort, vibration in the dantien, agitation, tension release, coolness in dantien and lower back, coolness grows, heat limbs and face (cool/heat mix in the skull), analyzing, coolness/calmness, twitches in the face and throat, calmness, analyzing, lost in thoughts, loop-thoughts, heat in the face, aversion, blame, calm, coolness, pulsing throat, pulsing lower back, party shitty music (triumph), analyzing, heat in the face and limbs, image, ill-formed words, changed legs, storm of stings -> aversion 4-2-0-2-0-4-0, discomfort in the throat, image, spam, skull meridian opening from the Brow Ch. to the Crown Ch., coolness flows from Crown Ch to Brow Ch., "pros and cons", again coolness flowing in the up-down direction, "nobody listens", coolness flow, image, outside noise, "two quarrels", "pack of lies", "it's a fight", "I tried (swim) against the tide". Time is up.
[b:2g5q71dy]Goal for Next Session:[/b:2g5q71dy] Keep doing the 4FN & the concentration practice.
  • PabloP
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12 years 9 months ago #92674 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:3hhr8qn2]Date:[/b:3hhr8qn2] 04/29/13
[b:3hhr8qn2]Pre-Meditative Context:[/b:3hhr8qn2] 40' stretching & qigong
[b:3hhr8qn2]Length of Sits:[/b:3hhr8qn2] 40'
[b:3hhr8qn2]Posture:[/b:3hhr8qn2] half-lotus
[b:3hhr8qn2]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:3hhr8qn2] n/a
[b:3hhr8qn2]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:3hhr8qn2] tried silent noting but ended in choice-less awareness.
[b:3hhr8qn2]General Thoughts: [/b:3hhr8qn2]
* I bought the earplugs, as the outer noise of my new flat don't let me go any deep in meditation. The street cars sound almost disappear, they didn't bother anymore.
* Felt a big calmness right in the beginning but soon was disturbed by heat, which at first I thought it was a consequence of a previous hot bath, but the heat persisted (in a lower tone) and only subsided fully after finishing the session. Perhaps it's a effect of the earplugs. Or may be the combo of a longer qigong session plus hot bath plus earplugs. Time will tell.
* Other than heat, it was hard to note any other physical sensation. And that's really odd, because they are what I note more.
* Instead, thoughts were abundant, big time. It was almost as if physical sensations were replaced by thoughts. They were abundant but not overwhelming. More like a fun experience! They were so abundant that it was impossible to keep track of them, note them with the usual labels. So I just sit back and became aware of the flavors of thoughts as they were showing up.

There were three kinds of thoughts:
(i) at a superficial level there was "the commentator", lots of online thoughts making statements about arising thoughts
(ii) at a deeper level there was "the emotional response" to thoughts or commentator statements, this mind-states showed up with some seconds of delay, and sometimes they were easily tied up with the triggering thoughts as other new thoughts already were showing up.
(iii) at the deepest level I found the &quot;thoughts machine&quot;, it's like a process where there's an ever present volition of delivering thoughts, and the really odd thing is that many times the machine didn't have the raw materials to process thoughts, but nevertheless the machine tried to do it's job. It was felt like chewing without food, or gesticulating like actually speaking, but no words nor thoughts came out. Just the volition to deliver thoughts! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

In levels (ii) and (iii), thoughts were easily noted as not-self. In the level (i) sometimes yes, sometimes not.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92675 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
In yesterday's session the heat repeated, but after 10 minutes or so the heat shrink to the ears. The coolness bathed the rest of the body, with less intensity though. The usual physical sensations could be noted. Thought notes were abundant again. Calmness kept longer. Today, I'll start again with the report.
  • NickP
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12 years 8 months ago #92676 by NickP
Replied by NickP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
If left to its own devices, is the noting mind subtly more interested in some types of experiences than in others?
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92677 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Thanks for your continuous support. It's definitively no an EQ mind as there's preference (in this order) for energetic phenomena, over other physical sensations, and then mind-states, feeling-tones, and thoughts.

I think I have more sensitivity on auditory stuff, that's why the earplugs are of big help. I can see how sounds trigger thoughts and mind-states. Instead, I see clinging to restful dark eye-sight (or when the nimitta appears) but an automatic aversion to lights display. If the lights stay long enough, I manage more or less to accept them, something that doesn't happen very often.

&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;

Yesterday, I managed to sit for 60' despite having slept only 3 hours. All in all it was a good experience as the sleep deprivation forces me to let go, and the earplugs reinforced the calmness, the deepest I have experienced in formal meditation. The flip side is that my noting practice was not continuous but scattered because of enjoying the calmness. Hopefully, today I'll resume my previous noting practice.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92678 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
It's much easier to write a report of the session when much of what I'm noting are physical sensations. But when thoughts and mind-states predominate it gets hard to give a chronological detailed report, because there are a lot of things happening which aren't easy to describe.

Sat for around 40 minutes, and tried to do the Four Foundation Noting. With earplugs on, at first I noted some discomfort on the ears, vibrations in the torso, heat and bodily tics. No coolness showed up but there were vibrations at the Brow Chakra, which came and went away during the whole session. With no sound distractions, the mind went calm which was periodically interrupted by image-thoughts, remembering, reporting, melodies. Those triggered more thoughts, which I noted or noticed, as I was able to. All these phenomena stopped most times abruptly. I see myself caught it the last syllable or sound when the &quot;gone moment&quot; happens ([i:346j3k5a]a la [/i:346j3k5a]Shinzen Young's). So far, I cannot see what is triggering it, if I'm unconsciously recognizing one of the 3C's (something I wrote earlier in March), or if just happens. The thing is that I go deep for 10 seconds or so watching the spaciousness, but then concentration is lost and things show up in the periphery and soon I'm back again noting lots of stuff.

Around the middle of the session, there was [u:346j3k5a]big moment[/u:346j3k5a]. I was noting mental-states that were sprouting after thoughts and this calm-mind / scattered-mind cycle. Twice I noted &quot;they are all going away&quot;. As nowadays I'm not having a particular psychological problem, I moved on. But when noted &quot;don't leave me alone&quot;, I found that my mind was actually complaining that it felt being left alone when thoughts vanished. The event had a surprisingly psychological twist: in the past, fear of no-self was shown (in dreams) with aggression or terror, but this time it was pity. In some way, it felt more honest.

Later , a(n off-cushion) pain in the shoulder started to hijack the session. Noting didn't dissolve it, so I tried to focus on the &quot;interesting&quot; features of the pain (degree of stinginess, heat, the fading of the sensation, etc). It did help to keep, I could keep noticing what was going on. So, as a little practice, whenever I was noticing some ugly phenomena I noted the interesting aspects if it, and if the phenomena was nice I noted the ugly aspects. May be, this could help me wade through the craving/repulsion thing.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92679 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
During the weekend I sat for around 40 minutes each day, plus practiced ping-pong noting through Skype with Viktor (from DhO). It was a weird experience, as each one's noting push the other into their territory/ñana. It also takes time to adjust to the time gap between notes. Maybe in future sessions the practice will get sharper. What left me thinking is that at least one of the yogis should ideally reach EQ easily. Otherwise, the other's DÑ would drag both down.

I speculate that there may be many interesting variations to try out in this ping-pong noting, such as:

* A yogi notes physical sensations and mind-states only, while the other feeling-tones and thoughts only. As one pushes the other into the same territory, hearing the other noting the other`s stuff may enrich both practices. They would be noting some phenoma while noticing indirectly other, as the partner would be bringing in stuff to the foreground.

* A yogi notes the attractive aspects of physical sensations, while the other on the unattractive ones. Just like the above point, reinforce both practices regarding the hindrances to meditation.

%%%%%%%%

Regarding my practice, I'm gaining concentration by using the earplugs, and my sensing of physical phenoma is getting back. Nevertheless, keeping the pace with noting is harder, not because I get absorbed in jhana, as I try to investigate the periphery while in deeper calmness, but because I easily alternate between periods of big concentration with others of lost in thoughts, specially after the 20-30 minute mark. Would multiple short sessions per day work better than a single 60 minute session????
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92680 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:35osxets]Date:[/b:35osxets] 05/07/2013
[b:35osxets]Pre-Meditative Context: [/b:35osxets]10 minutes stretching and Qigong
[b:35osxets]Length of Sits:[/b:35osxets] 50 minutes
[b:35osxets]Posture:[/b:35osxets] half-lotus
[b:35osxets]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:35osxets] Low EQ
[b:35osxets]Meditative Techniques Utilized: [/b:35osxets]Four Foundation Noting, 10 minutes each, and briefly Aversion Parameter Evaluation.
[b:35osxets]General Thoughts: [/b:35osxets]
* Earplugs made a big change in my practice. After a week or so of using them, the heat and discomfort have vanished almost completely, I can note again all phenoma in a steadier calmness. It's funny that in 2012 a did several months of kasina practice and this year I tried an Ipod app for maybe two months. But in just a week I could get much deeper.
* This longer calmness made me avoid a (paradoxical) tension in the eyeballs when I was in fact trying to release it. Before, I was following with the eyes the opening of the space, which usually meant pointing in an angle to the ground. Yesterday, I could stay with no strain in a parallel line to the ground (like trying to see the horizon but actually not doing any effort in going that far). Not only the eyeballs relaxed fuller but the remaining tension in the ears disappear too. It felt just like when I first hit Low EQ during March, before sliding back. Also, there's Aversion Zero in that situation. But when I started to investigate the scene, I found tension and agitation in the breath. More work to do.
[b:35osxets]What worked, what didn't: [/b:35osxets]Able to do two sessions in a row, and against all odds tap Low EQ.
[b:35osxets]Aversion baseline:[/b:35osxets] 1~2 , low point: 0, high point: 2
[b:35osxets]Goal for Next Session:[/b:35osxets] Keep exploring the eyes-ears-breath connection and Aversion.
  • peong
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12 years 8 months ago #92681 by peong
Replied by peong on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal

&quot;PabloP&quot;:ozwa9wpa wrote: but because I easily alternate between periods of big concentration with others of lost in thoughts, specially after the 20-30 minute mark. Would multiple short sessions per day work better than a single 60 minute session????[/quote:ozwa9wpa]

I would like to know the answer as well because I have similar experience. If I count the breath, I would start to lose count or space out after 30min. And this situation continues until the session ends, be it at 45min, 1hr or 1.5hr.

peong

  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92682 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Guess everyone has to find it out on their own... When doing vipassana for long periods, the standard practice is one hour of sited meditation and next other hour of walking meditation. Maybe, in the case of concentration practices, you could do 30 minutes of breath count and the next 30 minutes colored kasina. In fact, last year I did this, but kasina first.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92683 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Couldn't practice for three days in a row, then resumed practiced in the weekend, sitting for 30 minutes each day. Plus, Viktor and I did ping-pong noting and exchanged notes for 60 minutes. I resolved that for the time being, I'll do two daily sessions of 30 minutes each instead of trying a one 60 minutes sit, as it's problematic in my social life (and soon will be worse as my son will be born in a couple of months) and so far my crappy concentration fades away in half an hour.

Regarding ping-pong noting, it was interesting to notice that this protocol don't allow much thoughts to arise and instead do let mind-states pop-up, because of the human interaction. When I meditate on my own, it's the other way around. The other thing that happened is that there's always funny situations in this paired noting. Besides having a good laugh or smile, the interesting thing is that I could actually do some vipassana to &quot;happiness&quot;, that is, the residual good mood left behind after a good laugh. It surprised me how long did it last, and the connections of the corners of the mouth with a general relaxed skull-facial muscles. (I have tried in the past the Vimalaramsi's method, it was good but felt mechanic. This time it was genuine. ) It said that we cling to pleasant things and avoid unpleasant ones. But it also happens that in vipassana is the other way around, we (I) are eager to find ugly stuff and elude the nice one. In the financial markets there's a saying: investors end up &quot;stretching looses and putting a cap on profits&quot; (estirar las pérdidas y acortar las ganancias).

Having said that, when I meditated on my own this weekend, it was a mix of samatha and vipassana. As I'm using earplugs, it starts as a samatha but I investigate and note the aspects of it. (Will add more later).
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92684 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
Did only 30 minutes today. Rather quickly, I got into a deep dark and calm space. Once it didn't go any deeper, I started to investigate the place and whether I could sense physical sensations, feeling-tones, mind-states and thoughts. All four were lessen, still I could start noting. With some practice, I see now that I can stay in that calmness and be noting. Before, I was soon losing the calmness when starting noting.

Later, many thoughts were noted as not-self. But the funny thing is a couple of times the label was noted as not-self too! Something like &quot;Hearing the Noter&quot;. Another interesting by-product of using ear-plugs is that when loop-thoughts begin to arise, there's pressure building is the ears/jaws area, so it's a good alert before I get lost in thoughts.

Finally, there was an interesting phenomena to observe. When thoughts vanish totally, I can begin to hear a low pitch wavy sound (maybe 5 Hz) coupled with vibrations and pulsing in the middle of the brain. I'll try to investigate it more next time.

When in that deep calmness, the lights that begin to appear are different from the usual nimitta or shrinking circles going away. Instead, they have like a 3-D appearance, like a raceme (cluster) of lights opening, with little rays pointing in different angles (away from a supposed axis).

It's hard to put me in a map nowadays. There's some minor discomfort in the chest-high abdomen area every now and then, but no major problems. This could be EQ but also a spacey A&amp;P, who knows!
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92685 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:i8hnvmlp]Date: [/b:i8hnvmlp]05/14/2013
[b:i8hnvmlp]Pre-Meditative Context: [/b:i8hnvmlp]10 minutes stretching and Qigong, before that I came home excited by a recording session and future music plans
[b:i8hnvmlp]Length of Sits:[/b:i8hnvmlp] 30 minutes in the morning, 40 minutes in the evening
[b:i8hnvmlp]Posture:[/b:i8hnvmlp] half-lotus
[b:i8hnvmlp]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:i8hnvmlp] Low EQ
[b:i8hnvmlp]Meditative Techniques Utilized: [/b:i8hnvmlp]Four Foundation Noting, silently. Focused more heavily on Impermanence
[b:i8hnvmlp]General Thoughts: [/b:i8hnvmlp]
* I woke up earlier today, and I managed to take a 30 minutes break in my (home) job to meditate. It wasn't a nice session, after some minutes of a samatha-like stage soon I was lost in thoughts and/or falling asleep. Next time, I would note out-loud from the beginning.
* In the evening session, I had to deal right at the start with a solid discomfort in the chest (probably residual excitement from the music stuff). I kept noting physical sensations for 15 minutes. When noting the spot, I could only see vibrations in the periphery of the object, else it remained to be solid. I switched to feeling-tones and observe if there was a difference...not much, but thoughts and emotions were more easily seen. [ [u:i8hnvmlp]EDIT:[/u:i8hnvmlp] there were fear images and stories that lasted for a couple of minutes ]. Only when thoughts disappeared abruptly, did the discomfort in the chest disappear. The remaining minutes of the session was a back and forth of thoughts disappearing and reappearing when noting broke concentration.

* One interesting thing is that to gain back concentration I followed the pulse (pressure) in the ears (because of ear-plugs). Doing that, I could only relax, and that lessen the pressure in the zone, the sound disappear and the mind got calm without thoughts arising. I think there's no risk to watch the heart-beat in the ears. Daniel and other advanced yogis said it was risky to focus in the chest area, because it could disturb the heart.

* Like yesterday, when the calmness arrived, there was a low pitch wavy sound, and vibrations in the spine and brain. Probably it's just the blood circulating what I'm sensing.

[b:i8hnvmlp]Goal for Next Session:[/b:i8hnvmlp] If reached a calm state, start to evaluate Aversion.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92686 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:1xfhs9gb]Date:[/b:1xfhs9gb] 05/15 - 05/16 - 05/18 - 05/19
[b:1xfhs9gb]Length of Sits: [/b:1xfhs9gb]30', 30', 45', 30'
[b:1xfhs9gb]Posture:[/b:1xfhs9gb] half-lotus
[b:1xfhs9gb]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:1xfhs9gb] Low EQ

[b:1xfhs9gb]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:1xfhs9gb] Four Foundation Noting, silently. Focused more heavily on Impermanence. On Sunday, ping-pong noting with a fellow KFD yogi

[b:1xfhs9gb]General Thoughts: [/b:1xfhs9gb]
* Gaining concentration
* Passed through DN symptoms very quick
* In fact, there's little physical sensations coming up front, coolness and vibrations are there only when I search for them. This could be a side effect of using earplugs, or perhaps a phase in EQ, or both (or none <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> ).
* The most interesting thing of the last few days is that I found a spot/place/posture where I get into deep relaxation (all eyeballs and jaws tensions fade away, eyes looking up front with no angle to the ground, watching at no more than two inches away), where even my breath don't get agitated. Kind of an &quot;Aversion Free&quot; spot, where I could managed no to ruin the letting go with anticipation and/or fear.

* [u:1xfhs9gb]Added: [/u:1xfhs9gb]There's also a trade off in ping-pong noting, between a 1 note per second with a (say) 1 note every 3 seconds. In the former there's more concentration building up but there's little time to hear the partner's notes.

[b:1xfhs9gb]Goal for Next Session:[/b:1xfhs9gb] If reaching a calm state, start to evaluate Aversion.
  • PabloP
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12 years 8 months ago #92687 by PabloP
Replied by PabloP on topic Re: Pablo P. Practice Journal
[b:g1a0hgvz]Date:[/b:g1a0hgvz] 05/21 to 05/25
[b:g1a0hgvz]Length of Sits: [/b:g1a0hgvz] 45' most days, 90' on Saturday
[b:g1a0hgvz]Posture:[/b:g1a0hgvz] half-lotus
[b:g1a0hgvz]Cutting Edge Insight Stage of the Session:[/b:g1a0hgvz] Low EQ

[b:g1a0hgvz]Meditative Techniques Utilized:[/b:g1a0hgvz] All-round silent noting with earplugs, mixed with concentration practice.

[b:g1a0hgvz]Dynamics: [/b:g1a0hgvz] Start with silent noting. If physical phenomena predominate, Annica and dukkha are on the front line. When thoughts predominate, anatta and dukkha. In the later case I watch the physical symptoms when thoughts arise and pass (tensions, vibrations, energy flow), to complete the missing one (Annica) and avoid losing concentration. When thoughts are not abundant, I practice noting the vibrational aspect of low, middle and high pitch tones, and use the low pitch tone as an anchor for concentration.

[b:g1a0hgvz]General Thoughts: [/b:g1a0hgvz]
* DN physical symptoms are seldom noticed, mostly they are thoughts and mind-states, specially when the eyes sight points to the ground.
* Concentration is increasing, longer periods (up to 2 minutes) close to 1st Jhana.
* Once stabilizing the relaxed thoughts-free aversion-free &quot;state&quot; I search for things to note, mainly physical sensations.
* If this doesn't happen, I focus on the low pitch tone, both to use it as an anchor for concentration, and because after some time vibrations are perceived. It's interesting because other sounds/noise tend to trigger thoughts, but not this one.

[b:g1a0hgvz]Goal for Next Session:[/b:g1a0hgvz] Keep trying to sit for longer periods, 90' would be best.
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