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General Practice Updates

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14 years 8 months ago #1632 by Kate Gowen
Replied by Kate Gowen on topic General Practice Updates


Yeah, hats and rabbits! :-) But that's just a front. Thom's the real deal. He's about the most magic person I've met in a decade or three, and I've only been around him for a few hours.


-jake


Can a bodhisattva be a clown? a doctor? a magician?

You might also like David Abram-- The Spell of the Sensuous, and Becoming Animal-- his own amazing transformative fool's journey began as a trip to interesting countries to study shamanism; his entree was provided by his facility with 'showman's magic.'

http://www.amazon.com/Spell-Sensuous-Perception-Language-More-Than-Human/dp/0679776397/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1305480124&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Animal-Cosmology-David-Abram/dp/0375421718/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1305480124&sr=1-2
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14 years 8 months ago #1634 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
Oh thanks, Kate - that looks like fun. The blurb mentions he did "second sleep" schedule for a while - I've been doing that for a year now (wake up at 3-4 am or so, read a bit, chat with partner, write a bit, skype friends in other parts of the world, get up and poke around on computer, whatever, then go back to bed until 7ish). I think it is very refreshing, and it removes that "omg I woke up in the middle of the night and can't fall back asleep" anxiety that can happen). Plus I tend to dream more memorably during the second sleep.
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14 years 8 months ago #1635 by Kate Gowen
Replied by Kate Gowen on topic General Practice Updates
Thanks, Ona-- so now we have TWO adventurers reporting in. Great!
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14 years 8 months ago #1636 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
Adventures in consciousness, right up my alley. :D

Occasionally when I wake up in the morning I get to watch myself waking up. First there's just a sort of general awareness of not being asleep, then a slightly more alert state kicks in and remnant dream imagery transitions into sensory awareness, like birds singing, being hot or cold. Then thinking starts up, but usually a kind of languid following of various half-thoughts or sensations, nothing urgent. And then the little internal voice clicks on, reminding me I need to remember to call so and so, do the laundry, and that the plumber's coming at 8am. Then I'm up. There's probably names for all those parts. Maybe that book will have useful things to say.

I've never been able to watch the falling asleep part much at bedtime. I'm usually tired and just lay down and clunk, gone. But I've watched myself fall asleep while meditating, which is a bit comical.* Friends say with effort you can carry that attention over to bedtime too, but I think I might be lazy.

*If it's the kind of falling asleep that's interfering with your practice, I highly recommend sitting on the very edge of a hard chair in front of an air conditioner or fan, while imagining your hair is on fire. Works like a charm. I did it many times.
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14 years 8 months ago #1637 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
(just to add - great Ted talk about being wrong!)
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14 years 6 months ago #1638 by cruxdestruct
I just had a minor insight experience looking at my sneaker. That was nice.
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14 years 6 months ago #1639 by cruxdestruct
I was having a lot of lustful thoughts during meditation today, so I followed the advice of the Buddha et al. and started deconstructing the sexy ladies who popped into my head into their component anatomies like a bunch of fucked up death metal medical textbooks. It totally worked and I dropped into a deep concentration and expansive awareness.
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14 years 6 months ago #1640 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
I meant to ask you about that sneaker incident. What was it?

I don't think I've ever "desconstructed" an unexpected visitor. Sounds like it worked well enough, eh?
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14 years 6 months ago #1641 by cruxdestruct
Yeah, it worked really well. It wasn't even that gross; I didn't feel any sense of revulsion, and I didn't have to work that hard to gross myself out—I'm pretty squeamish about squishy body stuff and images of like, organs are pretty gross to me. I just more-or-less dispassionately deconstructed the women I was seeing into component body parts, reminding myself that objects of sexual desire have a bunch of fundamental physical qualities that don't get included in that fantasy, and I stopped flowing out in that direction.

The sneaker thing was: I have a pair of really fancy sneakers that were given to me by a friend. Really fancy, pricey leather, etc. But one of qualities of the shoes is that they have some water/salt damage, a little bit; I dunno if you know what fine leather gets like when it gets damaged, but there are basically little wavy sections at the bottom of the upper that are hardened and slightly raised. It can be slightly ameliorated with proper care of the leather but not entirely reversed. So when I wear that pair of sneakers there's an awareness of the damaged section in contrast to the very nice section. And I was just kind of idly looking at my shoes that day, not particularly freaking out about the damaged section, but just sort of observing them, and suddenly I had a baseline feeling and awareness that there was nothing actually _wrong_ with those shoes, or the damaged section, that they were just the way they were, and any sense of a deficiency or lack is something that's added in perception.

Which is nice about Buddhism. A non-practitioner who's nevertheless very well-adjusted can hopefully come to a place where they think, 'Yeah, the shoes are kind of fucked up, but they're mostly really high quality and you got them for free after all, so it's still a net positive.' But that's dukkha, baby!
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14 years 6 months ago #1642 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates


Yeah, it worked really well. It wasn't even that gross; I didn't feel any sense of revulsion, and I didn't have to work that hard to gross myself out—I'm pretty squeamish about squishy body stuff and images of like, organs are pretty gross to me. I just more-or-less dispassionately deconstructed the women I was seeing into component body parts, reminding myself that objects of sexual desire have a bunch of fundamental physical qualities that don't get included in that fantasy, and I stopped flowing out in that direction.

-cruxdestruct


Sorry, that just cracks me up, because I can totally imagine it. I've had a host of strange creatures visit uninvited during meditation, and even in the case of a few who were downright nasty and violent I very rarely sent them away. The few times I did it was out of fear. Attractive stuff is more insidious a distraction than repulsive stuff, I suppose, because one is less motivated to ignore or deconstruct it. Interesting. The most distracting or difficult things for me were usually abstract. Give me a monster over an abstract feeling of terror any time.


The sneaker thing was: ... suddenly I had a baseline feeling and awareness that there was nothing actually _wrong_ with those shoes, or the damaged section, that they were just the way they were, and any sense of a deficiency or lack is something that's added in perception.


-cruxdestruct


Awesome.
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14 years 6 months ago #1643 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
Just one other thought. You said, re: the sneaker: "... suddenly I had a baseline feeling and awareness that there was
nothing actually _wrong_ with those shoes, or the damaged section, that
they were just the way they were, and any sense of a deficiency or lack
is something that's added in perception."

What if you said that about the distracting ladies and the distraction they were producing?
  • Dharma Comarade
14 years 6 months ago #1644 by Dharma Comarade
Replied by Dharma Comarade on topic General Practice Updates
There is a long time San Francisco Zen Center teacher who is notorious for finding a corpse in Golden Gate Park and then not reporting to the authorities because he wanted to use it as a meditation object.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reb_Anderson
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14 years 6 months ago #1645 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
AH! That's hilarious! I love a crazy teacher. Keeps the world interesting.

It's interesting though, how we each have things we prefer to keep in the "bad" and "good" boxes, and how these insights sometimes pop through, where we see that the boxes aren't relevant. What things kick that off for each person are so varied. There's another box we overlook sometimes, which is the "not spiritually relevant" box.

I remember a week when I was feeling so equanimous about "unpleasant" stuff - like the rotting corpses of road kill were as whole and complete as the beautiful snow-covered trees - but then had a moment of insight looking at something completely banal. I was looking at a meaningless stupid humor website, and realized that was also the same. There was also no "deficiency or lack" (as Zach puts it) in the website or the viewing of it. That moment was as whole and complete as any other moment. I realized then I had invented this other box, the "not spiritually relevant" box. And that blew my mind.
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14 years 6 months ago #1646 by cruxdestruct


Just one other thought. You said, re: the sneaker: "... suddenly I had a baseline feeling and awareness that there was nothing actually _wrong_ with those shoes, or the damaged section, that they were just the way they were, and any sense of a deficiency or lack is something that's added in perception."What if you said that about the distracting ladies and the distraction they were producing?

-ona

The issue with those ladies was not any deficiency or lack (indeed they were quite comely), but they were distractions from my meditation object. They caused me no suffering, but just because something doesn't cause suffering doesn't mean it's conducive to what you've set out to do. I actually don't do nearly any (believe it or not) so-called 'bare attention'.
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14 years 6 months ago #1647 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
I'm going to chuckle about "bare attention" all evening. :D
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14 years 5 months ago #1648 by cruxdestruct
My teacher just asked me if I would like to occasionally lead the group on Thursday nights. I'm freaking the fuck out right now, a little bit.
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14 years 5 months ago #1649 by Jackson
Replied by Jackson on topic General Practice Updates
Does that mean you agreed?

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14 years 5 months ago #1650 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
Good for you! I find mentoring and helping others with their practice is really rewarding and a way of offering service. I hope you enjoy it.
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14 years 5 months ago #1651 by Shargrol
Replied by Shargrol on topic General Practice Updates
I thought I would post something from my notes, but instead I think I'm going to summarize...

It seems like I'm transitioning into something new. It's less about refining and more about dropping. Entire approaches to this "self" living a "life" just seem so complicated and without a guarantee... and they get dropped. Worries about the future might be right or wrong, who knows, so they get dropped. Even hobbies (which have bordered on obsession) just feel a bit like false advertising and they lose their intensity.
I remember reading a story of one (western) zen teacher who realized at one point her entire house was essentially empty. She had been getting rid of things she didn't use and wasn't buying anything more. It's kinda that dynamic.
A little bit of fear, too. Dropping is different from refining because there is less conscious intent. Not controlled. How far will it go? But mostly trusting that if the process isn't forced or fetishized-and-identified-with... well, things will be okay.
Interestingly, all of this has come after a period of less practice and more lazy listening to what seems most true about my desires.
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14 years 5 months ago #1652 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates


It's less about refining and more about dropping. Entire approaches to this "self" living a "life" just seem so complicated and without a guarantee... and they get dropped. Worries about the future might be right or wrong, who knows, so they get dropped. Even hobbies (which have bordered on obsession) just feel a bit like false advertising and they lose their intensity.
I remember reading a story of one (western) zen teacher who realized at one point her entire house was essentially empty. She had been getting rid of things she didn't use and wasn't buying anything more. It's kinda that dynamic.
A little bit of fear, too. Dropping is different from refining because there is less conscious intent. Not controlled. How far will it go? But mostly trusting that if the process isn't forced or fetishized-and-identified-with... well, things will be okay.
Interestingly, all of this has come after a period of less practice and more lazy listening to what seems most true about my desires.



-shargrol


Interesting. This resonates with my own experiences. I first began meditating after a spate of deaths and accidents that felt like a "man behind the curtain" experience - dealing with the aftermath of two deaths I realized all that stuff we pile up and save and keep as if its so precious just ends up in a pile in an estate sale... why were we so attached to it??? One of the first reactions I had was to start getting rid of stuff. Over the next couple years the trend continued. I realized how much stuff I had because "one day I might use it" or because it represented something I once did but no longer had an interest in or time for. Books saved from college represented things I once knew. Art supplies represented a wish to make stuff that I never actually spent time on. Musical instruments reminded me of times past when I had friends to play music with. Photography equipment saved in the hope that one day I'd take nice pictures. But all of that stuff could be used NOW by someone else, and I needed none of it. I gave away, donated and sold box after box of stuff. And it felt liberating, not to cling to those hope and memories, but instead to just do what I'm doing now and be thoroughly into that. :)
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14 years 5 months ago #1653 by Chris Marti
I think dropping stuff is a a kind of sign post in practice. If that's what's happening then it's probably a good thing.

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14 years 5 months ago #1654 by cruxdestruct
Judging from the growing anxiety of my fellow Manhattanites, one of the primary benefits to being a meditator is that you know you have something to do when the power goes out.
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14 years 5 months ago #1655 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates


Judging from the growing anxiety of my fellow Manhattanites, one of the primary benefits to being a meditator is that you know you have something to do when the power goes out.

-cruxdestruct


Indeed! Also fantastic for boring meetings, flight delays, being stuck in traffic, and standing around for hours while your partner shops for clothes or shoes. :D
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14 years 5 months ago #1656 by Ona Kiser
Replied by Ona Kiser on topic General Practice Updates
You know, this could be the best marketing for meditation, rather than the "relieve stress and relax" pitch:

-never be bored again! stuck in traffic? power out? no TV? flight delayed? you won't even care! in fact, it will be fun!
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