Sitting Long or Short, and How Often?

Are you serious? I went through a long spell of doing 2 to 3 hours a day (broken up into 30 minute sits every few hours). I can see how one could get monastic and do more. I found that the short repeated sits tended to have a carry-over effect - I'd often sit down and pick up "right where I left off". A sort of momentum. But to each their own! Most people I know sit once or twice a day, maybe extra on weekends.

Technically more might/should make your practice go deeper faster, but I think that is highly dependent on the skillfulness of the practice and the teaching you are getting and applying. You can sit all day doing poor practice and it's probably mostly a waste of time. You can be mindful during work and daily life and get benefit from that.

What do you think?

Lazy!

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

maybe reading about people sitting 8 hours a day made you tired.

Yeah. But if you'd get your lazy ass on a cushion and sit 48 hours a day 10 days a week you'd understand. You can't even fathom the depths of practice you are missing out on with your lame householder lifestyle. Kids? Wife? Job? Puleeeez! Get your priorities straight, or you'll never attain 99th Grade Bodhisattvaramadhamma! You think awakening is some ordinary thing, like you can just have a normal life? Ha! Loser! I've got a Bodhi tree growing in my own backyard. I've sat under it so long my skin is fused to the bark. I subsist on air and sunlight! You eat pizza like a muggle! Ha!

(just to make you laugh, Chris, dear)

Ona, you sure made me laugh! "Bodhisattvaramadhamma" - love this. Although, you could have added "lama-ding-dong" to the end of it.

I may have mentioned it before, but my practice regimen has consisted of one or two 20 minute daily sits (almost always in a chair, resting my back). I sit for longer sometimes on the weekend; sometimes more than an hour. But, again, it's on the couch, sitting upright but resting my back against pillows to stay upright. My legs and hips are incredibly inflexible, so cushion practice never really appealed to me.

Aside from that, I pay attention a lot, and inquire a lot, pretty much all day long. Driving is a good time for pratice, as is bathing, and the wakeful period that drifts into sleep at night.

Doesn't sound all that "hardcore," does it. I'm good with that.

Of course, I'd love to be able to sit on a cushion more regularly. I have a zafu and zabuton - black, Zen style. And, I spent a couple months working on yoga last summer, which improved my flexibility in the short term. But school made it difficult for me to keep up the routine, so I dropped it. I plan to take up yoga again sometime in the - hopefully near - future. I really enjoy it.

So, yeah - short sits are very effective. I also notice a carry-over effect. Shorter sits can build momentum so long as you do them consistently. At least that's what I know for myself. I don't know if sporadic sitting works, whether in the short- or long-term, because I've never done it that way.

More and more, I think you (Chris) and a few others are at one end of the bell curve (and I'm both happy for you and jealous... but only jealous enough to motivate my own practice!).

I would say most of my whoa! insights have come during times of more long and low intensity sitting. It's a bit of a catch-22 of course, long sits seem to happen with equanimity and equanimity seems to be the place of insights. But in general, I think if folks can sit for that long, it's probably a sign that they should sit that long.

It's also probably good in the early stages, because even though it's crap sitting usually (at least it was for me, lots of planning, day dreaming, theology, etc.) but it's a way of getting through all of that if you don't have the intitial wisdom (which I didn't, probably still don't) to focus on the meditation object/process.

@jackson - in the past have you sat longer?

What works for any given person must vary a great deal. I do know people (in person, friends) who sat for years for very long hours and made very little progress until they switched to one-on-one work with a good teacher that made them really pay attention in new ways. I know people (in person) who are beginners who sit 20-30 minutes a day and make really rapid progress. We each have our own karmic load, habits, tendencies, inclinations and so on which impact our practice. The hours in in and of itself is only one factor of many that impacts ones practice, surely.

It's difficult to know just which factors allow one to make significant progress with what seems like less time spent on formal practice.

I'm sure some of it is just latent capacity for this category of skills. Some folks pick things up faster than others, and there's really no discernable reason other than their just formed in such a way as to take-to certain things naturally.

But then there's the role of other areas of development that correlate to meditation practice, and may provide a better launch pad for some folks than others. For me personally, I grew up in the Foursquare church, in the throes of Pentecostal expressions of worship (e.g. tongues, prophecy, being "slain in the spirit," etc.). I went to church camps as a child and adolescent that inlcuded hours of intense prayer, singing, dancing, and entering ecstatic, trance-like states induced by surrender and the arousal of highly emotional devotion. I led worship for a number of years, rock n' roll style, which involved sensing where the Holy Spirit was guiding the hearts of the congregation. It was pretty intense! And really, really weird.

Weirdest of all - and I'm still weirded out by this - were words of prophecy. Not necessarily predictions, but knowledge nonetheless. This wasn't anything that I ever honed-in to the point of accessing this kind of knowledge at will. But there are times when surrender - letting go - allows for the sudden and spontaneous arising of knowledge, usually for someone else, to help them in some way. "Interpretation of tongues" is another "gift" that shows up for some people, and it's amazing how genuinely helpful the messages can be. Of course, anyone who tries to be special, or to wield such gifts with lots of craving, tends to be "off" more than "on" in their interpretation. Like I said, weird.



I came to meditation with this spiritual history at my heels. I imagine it had a significant influence on how quickly I was swept into the process.

How's that for mixing up the topic?

That makes a lot of sense, Jackson. My past spiritual practice involved a lot of devotion, ecstatic practices, trance and surrender - all things which can have a big impact (even unrecognizedly) on a later meditation practice.

You aren't weird. And Pentecostalism is quite common and popular, not weird. Or no weirder than dharma practice, anyway.

Is it okay if I think it's weird, but cool and interesting?

Yes, you can think it's weird and cool at the same time

I think it's both weird and not weird, really. It's weird in that it's the kind of topic that makes some people feel uncomfortable. It's not so weird in that, as Ona said, it's really quite common/popular to do the Pentecostal thing.

I haven't been a part of that scene 8 or 9 years, and I left it on bad terms. So, I sometimes feel uneasy about sharing my history with it, since I don't identify with it anymore. I'd be lying if I said that some of the same phenomena didn't occur when the more sophisticated contemplative technologies are practiced, because they most certainly do.

Pentecostalism has been referred to by some as "Main St. Mysticism," in that's it's the kind of a subtle realm practice package that can be tapped into quite easily, by just about anyone. For me at least, Pentecostal theology leaves MUCH to be desired.

Ona, thank you for reassuring me that I'm not weird Though I think I still might be kind of weird... and that's not such a bad thing.

http://sengchen.wordpress.com/2011/12/15/four-experiences-of-meditation/#more-172

Here is an interesting explanation of 'nonmeditation'; there are some things in it that may surprise,,,

Thanks for posting that link, Kate.

Every now and then, when I'm caught in the throes of a good TV drama, or immersed in everyday activities like doing dishes, or playing with my cats, there is a spontaneous noticing of the quality of mind during such times. It is sometimes startling. Left to its own nature, mind needs no improvement. Trying to grasp it just muddies it all up.

[The above was not written with any intention of philosophical consistency or sophistication]

Cool link, I'm gonna have to check out more of that blog.

It's funny. It's like I'm walking around in the dark turning a flashlight on and off, using this flashlight and that, experimenting with different kinds of bulbs and batteries, exploring the topography of experience and discovering and forgetting and re-discovering the most amazing and mundane things--- and occasionally I realize that was all a daydream, I've never been in the dark, don't need any special light or batteries, everything is crisp and clear without effort-- always. The very beginningless, endless nature of that glimpse makes the idea of grasping it-- shining a flashlight at the sun!-- the most hilarious thing ever!

"The very beginningless, endless nature of that glimpse makes the idea of grasping it-- shining a flashlight at the sun!-- the most hilarious thing ever!" -Jake

Nice one!