jgroove's practice journal

Got up at about 5:30 a.m. to sit on Saturday morning, probably 30-40 minutes. Sat again for 2.5 hours on Saturday night.

Morning and first hour of the evening sits were pure concentration practice, anapanasati. Trying to get some measure of concentration back after a week of vacation in which I did not practice, to put it mildly. At this point, getting through five or ten breaths without wandering is a questionable proposition.

Second hour of the evening sit was noting practice. Noted pressure (contact with cushion), warmth, touching (shirt at the abdomen), pressure (expansion of abdomen), coolness of the AC blowing down (pleasant), some neutral sensations, such as a certain sense of spaciousness or openness. Noted the heart beating at one point. Noted as unpleasant certain sensations such as leg falling asleep, periodic pains appearing and disappearing throughout the body, slight dullness or sleepiness. Mind-states such as investigation, wonder (hearing--sound of bullfrogs outside), 'anticipation, hoping' as a result of certain energetic changes (rushing or pressure at center of forehead, slight dissolving of sense of the body). Planning thoughts, dreaming, day-dreaming, 'dharma thoughts,' 'reporting thoughts,' remembering. Sensation of sweat on the skin, sweating, sweating.

Overall, the first hour seemed to be a pretty decent mix, as far as the disembedding process. However, toward the end of the first hour the torturous level of dullness/sleepiness that has plagued my noting practice in recent weeks set in again.
[cont.]

Falling asleep over and over and over, asleep to the point of actual dreaming. Unable to stay present at all. Labels ran as follows: wanting to quit practicing, wanting to go watch TV, boredom, agitation, frustration, distress. A lot of distress and frustration with the physical pain associated with being unable to sit for long without my legs falling asleep, as well as great frustration with the dullness/sleepiness.

Had to laugh at a certain point as the sitting degenerated into complete torture. I had resolved to stay on the cushion until 10 p.m. and would look at the clock, thinking 10 minutes had gone by, and only two or three minutes would have passed. I gave up on the noting practice, vowing to slog on until 11, and tried to just do concentration practice. But I could hardly stay with the breath at all. Tried to note myself back to the breath: sleeping, sleeping, dreaming, dreaming, frustration, frustration, distress, distress. Tried to meet the 'wanting to quit' on a sensate level. Not sure I was able to do this.

Shifting the position over and over due to the bodily pain. Early in the sitting the intention to shift would be seen clearly prior to the shifting. This was not at all the case later in the sit. Overall, the majority of this practice session was extremely unpleasant. I had to laugh as I got up to go to bed. Interestingly, I felt very 'off' after this sit, as though something were screwed up in my mind/brain. I had weird and largely unpleasant dreams and would periodically wake up with the feeling that something was off or wrong. I have absolutely no idea where I am on the maps.

"I have absolutely no idea where I am on the maps."

Hey Joel, I suck at the maps. So at the point you seem to be, I stopped worrying about them and would just sit there torturing myself. Then it dawned on me -- "Hey, there's something I could be doing!" This was just as I was starting to read MCTB, the oldest online version. So I would sit right here on my front porch and watch my breath until mind was at least some semblance of calm. Then I would watch the feeling of the breath entering and leaving my nose, laser beamed into that, to the exclusion of everything else. Worries, distractions, pain, all manner of crap would come up, especially at first, but I would throw it all over my shoulder and go right back to the nostril attention. Thus, in the middle of what seemed at first to be a mess of a practice, I discovered real vipassana.

"
"I have absolutely no idea where I am on the maps."

Hey Joel, I suck at the maps. So at the point you seem to be, I stopped worrying about them and would just sit there torturing myself. Then it dawned on me -- "Hey, there's something I could be doing!" This was just as I was starting to read MCTB, the oldest online version. So I would sit right here on my front porch and watch my breath until mind was at least some semblance of calm. Then I would watch the feeling of the breath entering and leaving my nose, laser beamed into that, to the exclusion of everything else. Worries, distractions, pain, all manner of crap would come up, especially at first, but I would throw it all over my shoulder and go right back to the nostril attention. Thus, in the middle of what seemed at first to be a mess of a practice, I discovered real vipassana.

"

Thanks, Chris. I took your advice and did an hour or so of at-the-nostrils breath meditation. Definitely seems as though I need to boost the concentration, especially after not practicing for more than a week. It is true that dullness/heaviness/sleepiness has been an issue for some time now, particularly when I do noting practice, but maybe the samatha end of things has been inadequate. Hmmm...

Hi, Joel. I could be inferring incorrectly here, but it sounds like there's some mild aversion or maybe even anger coming up with the noticing of dullness. Don't forget to note that as well. Preferences exist, we could say, but there is no one who prefers.

You also might try to cultivate dullness or sleepiness, and just see what happens. ; )

"Hi, Joel. I could be inferring incorrectly here, but it sounds like there's some mild aversion or maybe even anger coming up with the noticing of dullness. Don't forget to note that as well. Preferences exist, we could say, but there is no one who prefers.

You also might try to cultivate dullness or sleepiness, and just see what happens. ; )

"

True enough--definitely some kind of aversion or resentment of the dullness. Good point! Gotta just note it and not get enmeshed. Thanks.

Got up at 5 a.m. Started with at-the-nostrils concentration practice, trying to keep the attention at the spot rather than following the breath in and out. No restlessness or dullness. Breath became calm, slow, shallow. Periodic 'reporting thoughts.' I got caught up in one or two storylines, but for the most part the concentration was pretty good. Tried to relax as much as possible on the out-breath and kind of perk up on the in-breath, but then realized that this is a different practice'”conscious relaxation seems to take the focus of the attention off of the object. If you're going to be 'breathing with the whole body' and 'tranquilizing bodily formations,' it's a different practice. Concentration meditation is about sticking with the object. So maybe in the future I'll do this relaxation-oriented practice prior to the anapanasati.

Switched to noting practice after 30 minutes. Most of the attention was on bodily sensations and the rising and falling of the abdomen: rising, falling, softness, warmth, pressure, touching, itching, wanting to cough, etc. Noting of energy, third-eye/crown pressure, spaciousness. A few times, I was able to note the intention to straighten up or shift prior to straightening up or shifting. I still seem to find it difficult to pick up on subtler mind states. Noted 'investigation,' 'looking,' but not much else. Some categorization of thoughts: dharma thoughts, future thoughts, remembering, etc.

I've been thinking more about where I am on the path. I guess the current hypothesis, kind of at the macro level, is dark night yogi, with A&P having occurred more than 15 years ago. If there are nanas going on here, or any kind of cycling, I have great difficulty discerning this. This morning's sit was quite easy, energized and struggle-free. Sat on the back porch for a bit and did bystander-type practice. Quite a bit of vividness and clarity. There might be some progress going on, but certainly nothing dramatic. OK'¦

Inspired by Mike, I've been trying to take more time out in the day to just watch the rise and fall of the abdomen and check in.
Still, I'm on autopilot most of the time. I've been keeping up the daily practice and will keep working on staying present off the cushion. While I certainly want to be cautious about "scripting," I definitely have just come through some kind of phase marked by extreme doubt. I was feeling very doubtful about just about anything you can think of related to the path, especially everything having to do with my own sincerity/ability/potential for progress.
I did my best to just label this "doubting, doubting" and not get caught by it, with varying degrees of success.
And then, suddenly, this doubt vanished completely.
Right now, practice seems to be almost effortless. I can start to see what Kenneth means by alternating strata of mind, some difficult, others easy. I'll try to keep this in mind the next time I'm in a phase where I feel as though I can't stay awake or focus on the object for more than five seconds, or when doubt or restlessness seem to dominate.
Over and out...

Good to see a new post Jeff, I wondered what was up but didn't want to be too pushy. Sounds like a major hinderance attack hit you! It's inspiring that you kept up a practice in the midst of it and did the work to come out on the other side. I'm looking forward to read about what comes next.

I can relate to the doubt after increasing intensity of practice. Been there, seen that. Then seen it arise less. Up and down, up and down.

Thanks for your updates Joel,

Andrew

Sat for a total of about eight or 10 hours today'”45-minute sits, with some walking meditation in between. Started with a couple of periods in which I tried to focus only on the rise and fall of the abdomen, just to get the concentration going. I tried to make sure the labeling wasn't just automatic and mantra-like, but was an actual recognition of each moment of the rise and fall. The focus was mostly on body sensations today rather than mind states. Some sloth and torpor, but the hindrances didn't get to a torturous level.

Questions I'm working with:
I'm still not sure sometimes when to just move from object to object, once a second or so, and when to stick with and try to penetrate an object. I suppose if something is really presenting as the predominant object'”like a bodily pain or maybe intense pressure at the third eye or something'”one should then move toward that object and stay with it until it changes, dissolves, etc.

I don't quite know what to do with my eyes, actually. In Zen and in Tibetan Buddhism, they taught us to just stare ahead at a 45 degree angle, with a soft gaze that is not really focused on anything. I've mostly been ignoring all things visual lately, but have started to experiment some with actually looking straight ahead, even though the eyes are closed. Seems like this changes what's going on. I used the label 'seeing, seeing' a bit and noted both darkness and the patches of light. I wonder if NOt engaging the eyes is problematic or the best way to go or neither.

I'm pretty sure the noting that I'm doing is still a bit too diffuse and lackadaisical. Still working on how to be relaxed without being too slack.
Over and out...

10:45-11:00 metta/guardian
11:00-11:45 samatha
11:50-12:35 ''
12:35-12:45 walking
12:45-1:30 samatha
1:35-2:40 lunch/coffee
2:40-3:25 samatha
3:30-4:15 noting
4:15-4:30 walking
4:30-5:15 noting
Did a fair amount of sitting/walking today. Samatha periods were 'anapana spot' technique and breath-counting. Nothing rock-solid'”quite a lot of wandering mind, sleepiness.

Hearing, hearing (barking squirrels and dogs; cars speeding by outside; the hum of the AC unit; ringing in the ears; lawnmowers and yard tools outside). Seeing, seeing (blackness, pale-blue dots and clouds, overtones of red). Touching, touching (shirt on back, shoulders, abdomen; legs on cushion; hands on legs). Tingling (unpleasant, as with legs falling asleep; neutral (periodic tingling sensations on hands, back of arms, not painful). Aching, aching (lower back, left hip, shoulders; various pains throughout body)

Tried to stay with persistent pains and observe them. Can't say I penetrated the object particularly. Howeve, the persistent pains in my left leg and hip did noticeably change and shift. Tried to identify /sensations/mind-states in pairs: warmth, pleasant; aching, unpleasant.

Pressure, pressure (center of head, toward 'third eye' and crown'”persistent; tried to stick w' this sensation; pressure of hands on legs, legs on cushion, rise and fall of abdomen). Warmth, coolness (always 'pleasant'; warmth of feet on carpet during walking meditation; of shirt on body; of legs on cushion; AC on the skin; cool, tingling sensation at times on back of arms).

Remembering thoughts, reporting/dharma thoughts, visual thoughts (random, dreamlike imagery), mental 'hearing' (sounds of people talking, dreamlike). Planning thoughts. Amusement, irritation, wanting to stop practicing, fear/anxiety about interruption (triggered by sound of cars outside, bumps in house).

Swaying, swaying. Urge to straighten back. Straightening, straightening. Urge to shift (intending to shift, shifting, shifting). Nodding off, nodding off, wandering, wandering

During walking: lifting, stepping, placing, interwoven with daydreaming, daydreaming, planning thoughts, etc.

Rode the bike and jogged, lifted weights a bit afterward. Did some shikantaza in the chair'”could kind of see the noting mind itself as an object, as mentioned in Practical Insight Meditation. The Witness?

"
Remembering thoughts, reporting/dharma thoughts, visual thoughts (random, dreamlike imagery), mental 'hearing' (sounds of people talking, dreamlike). Planning thoughts. Amusement, irritation, wanting to stop practicing, fear/anxiety about interruption (triggered by sound of cars outside, bumps in house).

Swaying, swaying. Urge to straighten back. Straightening, straightening. Urge to shift (intending to shift, shifting, shifting). Nodding off, nodding off, wandering, wandering

During walking: lifting, stepping, placing, interwoven with daydreaming, daydreaming, planning thoughts, etc.

Rode the bike and jogged, lifted weights a bit afterward. Did some shikantaza in the chair'”could kind of see the noting mind itself as an object, as mentioned in Practical Insight Meditation. The Witness?"

vipassana!!!!!!
go go go

rising, rising, falling, falling, touching (feet on carpet, shirt on shoulders, arms, jeans on legs), pressure (contact with chair, tightness of jeans), warmth/pleasant (palms on legs, feet on carpet, shirt on body), coolness/pleasant (AC air on skin of hands/arms/face), sweating.
Visual thoughts (imagining, daydreaming), auditory thoughts (internal conversations), future thoughts, planning thoughts, remembering. Eagerness (reporting thoughts), wanting, wanting (to straighten spine/neck, swallow, get coffee, stop practicing). Aching/unpleasant (back pain). Burning-tinging/unpleasant (feet on carpet, buttocks on chair). Limbs-falling-asleep/unpleasant (needle-like tingling in feet, legs).

Straightening, straightening. Swallowing. Investigating. Intending to hold focus (on pressure at center of head). Vibrations/pressure (center of head/third eye/crown)--pleasant. Wanting absorption (unpleasant). Noticing, noticing (tension in face, body). Relaxing, relaxing.

Investigating, looking. Hearing, hearing. Alarm, surpise (sounds of others stirring upstairs). Unpleasant. Opening, opening (eyes). Seeing, seeing. Wanting, wanting (to quit practicing, get up, drink coffee). Diminution of body sensations with focus on center of head--increase in vibratory quality of subtle-energy sensations; rushing sound in ears. Floating, floating. Sense of spinning.

**Attention shifting to jgroove, smily face, thoughts of will he be the next to pop?**
I am gonna watch this thread like a hawk and send it and you some helpful dhamma vibes. GO JGROOVE!!!!!

"
**Attention shifting to jgroove, smily face, thoughts of will he be the next to pop?**
I am gonna watch this thread like a hawk and send it and you some helpful dhamma vibes. GO JGROOVE!!!!!

"

Ha! Thanks, Nik!

Joel, just scoped out your retreat day on July 17. Was that an independent retreat at home? How did it go, are you thinking about doing it again? I've some times thought KFD yogis could support each other by doing overlapping home retreat days.

"Joel, just scoped out your retreat day on July 17. Was that an independent retreat at home? How did it go, are you thinking about doing it again? I've some times thought KFD yogis could support each other by doing overlapping home retreat days."

Hi Mark.
Yeah, it was at home. I had the rare day to myself there and tried to put it to good use. I think coordinated retreat days is a great idea! Not sure when I'll be doing another one, but maybe people could post it on KFD when they put a retreat day on their schedule? Hmmm....
Have a great weekend,
Joel

app. 30 min., Aug. 5
rising, rising, falling, falling (abdomen). sweating/coolness/neutral. touching (shirt on shoulders, abdomen; shorts on legs; legs on cushion/floor). warmth/pleasant (palms on legs; legs on floor). Coolness/pleasant (AC air on arms, face). Sweating, sweating (drops rolling down back of neck, down back). Coolness (mixture of aversion, neutrality, interest in response to unusually profuse sweating).

Pressure (third-eye). Strobing--seeing, seeing (brief flashes of light). Wanting/interest (for increase; upleasant). Reporting thoughts/aversion to reporting thoughts (unpleasant). Pulsing. Seeing, seeing (darkness; pixels of pink/blue light; mild "Northern Lights"-like visual phenomena w' eyes closed). Hearing, hearing (ringing in ears; birds; fish tank filter; silence).

Headache (unpleasant). Intending to stay with headache; staying, staying--fades. Burning, needle-like pain in leg (limp falling asleep). Unpleasant. Pressure (buttocks, contact with cushion); mild burning, falling asleep--unpleasant.

Rising (sitting) falling. Straightening. Wanting to quit. Wanting to shift. Intending to shift. Shifting, shifting.

Investigation. Reporting thought. Imagining, imagining. Falling sleep. Sleepiness (unpleasant). Visual thoughts. Auditory thoughts. Dreaming/daydreaming. Future thoughts. Remembering--anger, resentment, embarrassment.

Aug. 6. Some stuff from 45-min. sit this morning.

Started with a few minutes of anapanasati.
Touching, touching [lower body on cushion, legs on floor, shirt on abdomen, back, shoulders, shorts on legs].

Warmth/pleasant, [feeling of palms on legs; feeling of legs on palms, feeling of legs/lower body on cushion, floor].

Coolness, pleasant [sweating, sweating].
Neutral-to-slight aversion: sense of perspiration on back, neck, cold drops rolling down].

Smelling, smelling [incense].

Rising, rising. Falling, falling. Rising [sitting], falling [straightening, touching, etc.].

Hearing, hearing [airplane outside, dogs barking, ringing in ears, static from radio playing MP3 timer]. Auditory thoughts [internal sound of conversation during moments of daydreaming, some kind of beginning of energy-related rushing sound].

Seeing, seeing [fluctuating blackness, pixels of smoky blue, pink].

Pressure, pressure [expansion and contraction of abdomen, hands on legs, lower body on cushion [after 20 minutes or so: burning, burning, unpleasant, needle-like tingling, falling asleep]
Subtle pressure [at third eye].

Intending to straighten, straightening. Sense of inside the mouth, feeling of tongue, inside of cheeks, saliva. Wanting to swallow. Intending to swallow. Swallowing. Tension in face, intending to relax tension. Relaxing, relaxing. Intending to relax whole body on out breath. Relaxing, relaxing.

Unpleasant: pain in left leg as it falls asleep; pain in lower back '“ aching, aching. Pain in left hip, aching, aching. Slight burning [pressure of lower body on cushion]. Intending to focus on pain in lower back. Staying, staying. Pain in lower back merges with pain in left hip. Persistent. Unpleasant. Aching.
[cont.]

[cont. from above]


Itching, itching [neck]. Tingling in hands/arms, particularly at wrist joints. Intending to focus attention at third eye and relax. Focusing, staying. Sense of absorption. Wanting to drop noting. Intending to notice body sensations without labeling. Noticing, noticing. Sense of absorption. Pleasant. Anticipation.

Investigation, looking, looking. Reporting thoughts. Curiosity. Future thoughts. Daydreaming. Auditory thoughts [hearing, hearing]. Imagining, imagining. Anticipation.

Hearing, hearing [sound of MP3 bell ringing].

Noted aloud for 60 minutes. Very interesting how the noting aloud prevented both falling asleep and just general spacing out. Will keep at this...

Haven't had a chance to try this yet, waiting for enough privacy in the small house we live in. Interested to hear more details of your experience with the technique.

The coolest thing about it was, as I started to fall asleep, the noting continued, and it was as though this prevented full-on sleeping/spacing out from occurring. I've had some big problems with falling asleep, so if this helps--great!
Talk to you later..